House of Eratosthenes

This curiosity about conservatives forgiving people is fascinating to me because it is so insincere. It isn’t even curiosity. Palin’s answer was, after all, perfectly decent and should have put any true curiosity to rest. But this isn’t the end of it, of course. The question will be raised again and again and again…of the conservative capacity to forgive, not of the liberal capacity to forgive.

And when you think about it, there are other answers Palin could have given that would be just as decent. “He took advantage of my daughter and the only way we’d have him for dinner is as target practice” would have been just fine. Maybe not politically palatable, but after all Levi’s done you certainly can’t say that would eliminate the Palins from our mythical community-of-decentpeepul.

In this age of Chicago brass knuckle politics, I have a lot more curiosity — real curiosity — about the liberals and their capacity to forgive and invite people over for Thanksgiving dinner. If 2009 really is the Year of Healing, and Thanksgiving is the season we’re finally going to start feeling it, here’s a list of ten I’d like to see. And no, I won’t be holding my breath for Oprah to be asking about these.

Anyone see this happening?

1. Campbell Brown could invite Sarah Palin over for Thanksgiving dinner.
2. President Obama could invite Joe the Plumber over for Thanksgiving dinner.
3. David Axelrod could invite Fox News over for Thanksgiving dinner.
4. Bill Maher could invite Dick Cheney over for Thanksgiving dinner.
5. The DailyKOS folks could invite Karl Rove over for Thanksgiving dinner (brave, brave Karl).
6. Charles Johnson could invite Robert Stacy McCain over for Thanksgiving dinner.
7. The NAACP could invite Clarence Thomas over for Thanksgiving dinner.
8. Code Pink could invite over some of our soldiers who volunteered to go to Afghanistan — volunteered! — over for Thanksgiving dinner.
9. The National Organization of Women could invite Ken Starr over for Thanksgiving dinner.
10. Mike Todd could invite blogger friend Rick over for Thanksgiving dinner.

The last of those might require an explanation so I’ll give a one-liner and a link. As Rick explained, he is the only breathing soul on the face of the planet ever to be banned from Mike’s blog. It’s obvious Rick is, at last report, beyond forgiveness, which is interesting to keep in mind when one observes Mike extolling the virtues of forgiving everyone.

Liberalism is a cheap way to look like a decent, forgiving person. The hatred they have for conservatives, is the hatred reserved for people who have no need of such a mask, felt by people who do.

Cross-posted at Cassy‘s place.

[…] Cross-posted at House of Eratosthenes. […]
- Cassy Fiano » Conservatives, Liberals and the Capacity for Forgiveness | 11/13/2009 @ 08:59
Great points, list and post Morgan.
- tim | 11/13/2009 @ 10:05
For many years we’ve had my wife’s ex over for Thanksgiving dinner and sometimes Christmas as well. He’s an ass, but he’s the kids’ dad, and we do Thanksgiving well at our place, so that’s where they come. I understand perfectly well what Sarah’s saying.

One year, when he was still a kid, the younger one came to us and said, “Dad doesn’t have anywhere to go for Thanksgiving. Can he come over?” My wife looked at me with a questioning look, like … “would it be alright with you?” … and it took me less than a few seconds to say, “sure, why not?”

And it was fine. He was well-behaved, and we all had a nice meal and drinks afterward and talked and enjoyed the evening. Every time. I know, if he’d behaved badly we would not have invited him again… but … that didn’t happen.

You’re right. This does not fit into the liberal stereotype of conservatives. They are convinced that Christianity is the worst thing to happen to the planet, but I’m tellin’ you, that’s where I got those values.
- philmon | 11/13/2009 @ 10:29
Sarah Palin is a fine example of an American and a human being in general. And she’s a conservative, and a popular one. This is why she is ridiculed daily by the liberal machine. They are afraid of her. Her success means their failure.
- philmon | 11/13/2009 @ 10:31
I gotta love you, Phil – you make me feel normal.

My eldest son and I used to spend Thanksgiving Dinner at my ex-in laws, with my ex-husband, his new wife, their kids and my new man, his ex-wife and their kids along with her new husband. Of course there were 20 other family member adults in attendance as it was a large clan, who all brought along their kids, step kids, exes, etc. It was fine, it was good for all of the children, they had both parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins all under one roof for the holiday. Everybody behaved and had a nice time. It was a little strange, but we made it work.

When my ex-father in law was dying, I was requested to spend the week prior to his passing in the hospital with my former family and I sat in the family pew at his funeral. (Two weeks spent in the Valley, away from work and home in Houston) I kept on good terms with these people, my son was their blood kin, divorce didn’t have to cut those important ties. If you have children involved, it’s best to act like an adult and get along, even if it might be a little uncomfortable once in a while.

I expect Sarah would welcome the father of her grandchild home for the holidays, she seems to be a level headed woman who cares for her family. She doesn’t strike me as a vindictive, neurotic bitch. Far from it, actually.

To your greater point of forgiveness, Morgan. (Sorry, Phil got me to digressing) Liberals like to harp on that subject because many of us are Christian, it’s an attack on faith just as much as it is an attempt to discredit conservatives as hypocrites. Fuck ’em. Forgiveness has nothing to do with Thanksgiving dinner and Levi gathering around the table, it has everything to do with trying to make Sarah’s grandchild feel happy and loved on a family holiday.

On another note, I do believe Stacy McCain would invite the lizard king to feast with his family. I think he would be a gracious host, feed him well, offer him a cigar, then beat the living shit out of that turd after Dallas kicks Oakland’s ass.

**man, long comment – I probably ought to go write some stuff on my blog. 🙂
- Daphne | 11/13/2009 @ 13:43
Not to self, must make Daphne’s place a regular blog stop.
- tim | 11/13/2009 @ 15:02
And this paragraph:

“Liberalism is a cheap way to look like a decent, forgiving person. The hatred they have for conservatives, is the hatred reserved for people who have no need of such a mask, felt by people who do.”

is an example of the genius that often permeates your writing. The petty bickering with other bloggers….I could do without that. It’s beneath your talents.
- sanskara | 11/13/2009 @ 20:40
That means a lot coming from you, Daphne. Thanks!
- philmon | 11/13/2009 @ 22:00
The petty bickering with other bloggers….I could do without that. It’s beneath your talents.

I would have to agree. But a lot of other chores are beneath our talents…they still have to be done. This one is on the order of purging toxins from the body. With no other outlet available, they’ll accumulate over time and eventually shorten the lifespan.

You have to look at it from the point of view of what these people want. They don’t really believe Jesus wanted money forcibly taken from rich people and distributed to the poor through a government’s tax coffers, or that if we pretend madmen like Saddam Hussein are harmless lovable fuzzballs, the Kingdom of Heaven is ours. They just want to say their silly stuff and get their validation. Problem is, if they get that validation with no resistance they’ll just keep pushing the envelope. The election of Barack Obama is just the culmination of lots of incremental build-up of these toxins.

And with that, the purging of the toxins has become vital not just to the health of the patient, but to the doctor as well. “Anyone opposed to Obama must be a racist” has a sticky-bomb quality to it — you cannot just ignore it. The don’t-dignify-it-with-a-response technique suddenly doesn’t work so well.

So how’d we get here? From people talking back to the dimbulbs, and driving them into pickled lunacy? Or letting them forge on ahead without resistance, pushing the envelope of silliness year after year? I lean toward the latter, partly because with this past summer’s tea parties taking place twelve months previous, I have a lot of difficulty envisioning us even having a President Barack Obama. Sometimes you have to stop an echo.
- mkfreeberg | 11/13/2009 @ 23:29
That backhanded slap from sanskara didn’t deserve a response, Morgan.
- Daphne | 11/13/2009 @ 23:42
No, he’s a decent fellow. James and I have broken bread together.

And the subject is a guy I’ve repeatedly referred to as “Mollusk Mike.” How do I argue with the point James is making, with the slime still on my clothes? He left a lot unaddressed (and I think he knows this), but he’s absolutely right in what he said.
- mkfreeberg | 11/13/2009 @ 23:59
I have a lot more curiosity — real curiosity — about the liberals and their capacity to forgive and invite people over for Thanksgiving dinner.

WHAT!!
A TRADITIONAL Thanksgiving dinner?
You’d cook and eat another living creature?
That’s FOWL!
I mean, um…Oh my GOD….!
I mean, um…Oh my STARS!
I mean, um…uh…ah…
SO, Have you quit beating your wife?
- CaptDMO | 11/14/2009 @ 09:20
Phil and Daphne: I’m awed with your forbearance and charity. I’ll leave it there.
- bpenni | 11/14/2009 @ 11:33
Buck – I would never suggest it would work in all situations. But thanks.

CaptDMO … funny!
- philmon | 11/14/2009 @ 12:42
[…] House of Eratosthenes, ever the source of wry enumerations, has a list of possible peace overtures: 5. The DailyKOS folks could invite Karl Rove over for Thanksgiving dinner (brave, brave Karl).6. Charles Johnson could invite Robert Stacy McCain over for Thanksgiving dinner.7. The NAACP could invite Clarence Thomas over for Thanksgiving dinner. […]
- Trend Spinner » Florida Manatee Joins Right-wing Alliance… | 11/17/2009 @ 17:07
[…] to see if they can “get along.” “Reach across.” Forgive and forget. Invite Levi Johnston to Thanksgiving. The redemption that is supposed to come from such things, never comes. Nobody ever looks back […]
- House of Eratosthenes | 11/26/2009 @ 15:01

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Conservatives, Liberals and the Capacity for ForgivenessFriday, November 13th, 2009

Conservatives, Liberals and the Capacity for Forgiveness
Friday, November 13th, 2009